Army Goes Multicam?

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

I tried googling it but all that comes up are yahoo answers and nothing that i tihnk is legit. But the other day our Battalion C/CSM told me that with in the next year or so the Army may be switching to a Multicam pattern and phasing out ACU's, just wondering if this is true. Also I want to know your takes on the two uniforms ACU's vs. Multicam.

[cscsmp]

Don't know that that's quite correct. I know as part of the Future Force Warrior program they use MultiCam's a lot. I've also heard the Army was going to issue a new uniform, but not sure if it's MultiCam or not and when that's actually supposed to happen, if at all. Personally I like ACU's but I think MultiCam is way better. It blends in with so much stuff it's ridiculous. My ACU's blend awesome with the grass up here in Western Nebraska but stand out horribly in the wooded areas. I know a guy that has a set of MultiCams and they work well just about everywhere. Good stuff.

[Airbourne Infantry]

Another change in uniform?! I'm all for using more effective cammoflauge but phasing in a new cammo scheme this soon might be difficult and expensive. I like the ACU color scheme along with the Multicam, but in all honesty, I LOVE the ACUs. As long as the only thing that changes on the uniform is the color scheme, I'm fine with that. For those of you who don't know what Multicam looks like, it's the same cammo the Soldiers used in the Transformers movie towards the beginning. Or, if you didn't see that movie here's a link to both so you can compare:

Multicam:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Multicam_example.jpg

ACU:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:U.S._Army_soldier_securing_site_-_Parun,_Nuristan_-_06-27-2007.jpg

[armysc_25b]

ACU's will go... eventually. They've changed the uniforms numerous times, so it's bound to happen. That said, I've heard the RUMINT that they might move on to Multicam, but it's all RUMORS and there's NOTHING official concerning it. That said, yes, Future Force Warrior uses the stuff, and Multicam was one of the designs looked at when we moved away from BDU's, but I would not expect such a swift change in combat uniforms (ACU's haven't even been around for 10 years yet, most seem to last at least 20).

[C/SSGT Seifer]

Yeah I think that they will be phased in eventually, but it is still to early. I have seen multiple reports about Future Force Warrior relying heavily on multicam but like I said the ACU's have been out for just a few years. To me the multicam's seem to reminiscent of the BDU's. I mean that is what they look like, just with smaller blotches.

[PhoenixCadet]

ACU's will go... eventually. They've changed the uniforms numerous times, so it's bound to happen. That said, I've heard the RUMINT that they might move on to Multicam, but it's all RUMORS and there's NOTHING official concerning it. That said, yes, Future Force Warrior uses the stuff, and Multicam was one of the designs looked at when we moved away from BDU's, but I would not expect such a swift change in combat uniforms (ACU's haven't even been around for 10 years yet, most seem to last at least 20).

Again with more RUMINT here, but I've also read a few places (internet sources, non official) that one of the reasons why MultiCam wasn't chosen over the ACU's (and why they still haven't started using it) is because MultiCam (as a company) would not make a digital version, which is what the Army wanted.

-PC

[armysc_25b]

Again with more RUMINT here, but I've also read a few places (internet sources, non official) that one of the reasons why MultiCam wasn't chosen over the ACU's (and why they still haven't started using it) is because MultiCam (as a company) would not make a digital version, which is what the Army wanted.

-PC
And to keep with the RUMINT, one of the main reasons I heard we didn't get Multicam was that they couldn't produce to what the Army wanted. So, we end up with these second rate uniforms...

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/3595/digitalmulticamey6.jpg

If multicam were to go digital (like the image above) isn't it just similar to MARPAT then?
O yea the imiage above came from me image googling Digital Multicam, it does have a different color scheme in my eyes but it could just be a set of worn out MARPAT, but comparing it to the colors of normal muilticam it seems about the same.

[armysc_25b]

Multicam in a digital version would basically be a variant of MARPAT, the way the two items look.

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

Was snooping around on the web and googled this, strengthening the nick name "Ghost gear" to Multicam. On some of the photos I could not even find the darn thing.

http://www.multicampattern.com/gallery.html

[HairyEyeball]

Having spent some time selling the commercial MulItiCam®, I've heard the rumors and talked to the manufacturer's reps. As to the 'digital or not', it's 'next generation' digital - just as the F-117 was all straight lines and angles because that's the best rendering the computers of the era were capable of, MARPAT® was first generation digital.

The Army did, indeed, consider it instead of the current design, but the quantity they needed was well beyond the capability of the company to produce, and the company wasn't comfortable with the quality and uniformity of what available subcontractors produced. The possibility of such a switch is still viable, although with the contemplated budget cuts in the defense budget, probably not during the current administration. As reasonable a 'predictor' as any is to keep tabs on what's showing up on your local 'surplus' dealer's shelves: If they have plenty of 'real' MultiCam® in stock, it's not likely to be in the supply chain.

[SPEC 11B ABN INF]

I really do hope that we transition into Multi-Cam. The ACU maybe nice if you spend most of your time in garrison however in the field its the worst uniform the army has ever made. Yeah you don't have to press them and you don't have to shine boots anymore. That's just being lazy all that does is build discipline into new soldiers and with the bunch we are getting in todays army we need that discipline.

Okay back on how much the ACU is not meant for the grunt. The life span is very short, after a month or two it has already begun to rip and fall apart. Second, the hook pile and tape (Velcro) is very loud. Doesn't work when your trying to open any pockets and NEED to be quite at that time in say a LP/OP or SKT. I don't really see much camouflage you get out of them and at night you glow which makes it ever easier to see you.

I've seen the new version of the Multi-Cam and believes that its the answers to those problems. The camouflage works, day or night. If you go back to the old BDU/DCU buttons would end the noise discipline. The material is like the BDU/DCU and doesn't wear and tear easily.

Oh yeah I've also been hearing that the multi-cam will be phasing out ACU's been looking on the internet for some hard facts couldn't find anything. It might just be "Joe Network".

[Remoah]

We've got a new uniform very similar in appearance to ACUs
Only difference, button + zip pockets. And the zips are all coated so they're noisless.

Pretty nifty, though you have to have a field set and a barracks set. Since washing will remove some of the IR Effectiveness (contary to what i said in a previous thread, we got told wrong before).

[C/SSGT Seifer]

Having spent some time selling the commercial MulItiCam®, I've heard the rumors and talked to the manufacturer's reps. As to the 'digital or not', it's 'next generation' digital - just as the F-117 was all straight lines and angles because that's the best rendering the computers of the era were capable of, MARPAT® was first generation digital.

The Army did, indeed, consider it instead of the current design, but the quantity they needed was well beyond the capability of the company to produce, and the company wasn't comfortable with the quality and uniformity of what available subcontractors produced. The possibility of such a switch is still viable, although with the contemplated budget cuts in the defense budget, probably not during the current administration. As reasonable a 'predictor' as any is to keep tabs on what's showing up on your local 'surplus' dealer's shelves: If they have plenty of 'real' MultiCam® in stock, it's not likely to be in the supply chain.

No offence to the Marine Corps, but MARPAT is pretty ugly. Multicam is very cool though. Has anyone on this thread tested its effectiveness in different environments? Does it come in different color sets (like desert or snow?)

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

Do you guys think that, if the Army ever goes MultiCam, then they will change the regulation on rolling our sleeves up? Hot competition days are killer on a kid who doesn't sweat and can't roll 'em up. :D

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

Does it come in different color sets (like desert or snow?)

I you look at the link I posted up a couple days ago, you can see that there are pics of MultiCam in the desert being completely unnoticeable, so I'm guessing they're only going to have a snow version to come, if they want to make one of course.

[cscsmp]

No offense to the Marine Corps, but MARPAT is pretty ugly. Multicam is very cool though. Has anyone on this thread tested its effectiveness in different environments? Does it come in different color sets (like desert or snow?)

Who cares if it's ugly if it works? Not saying it does, I have no idea if it does or not. But honestly, if it's gonna camouflage me well I really don't care if it's ugly or not...

[C/SSGT Seifer]

I've been thinking, once our boys (and girls) come home to the states will we keep the ACU's? I mean not a lot of the country is desert and I have been in a forest with my ACU's on and I stuck out like a sore thumb. Now that I really think about it, its logical to switch to multicam in years to come.

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

I've been thinking, once our boys (and girls) come home to the states will we keep the ACU's? I mean not a lot of the country is desert and I have been in a forest with my ACU's on and I stuck out like a sore thumb. Now that I really think about it, its logical to switch to multicam in years to come.

I agree with ACU's sticking out in the forest, but at spots where the sun can shine through the canopy is where I had trouble spotting my team mates during our most recent Raider competition, sad part is the sun isn't always out and isn't always up. I do agree that switching to ACU's is the best thing to do, and if I am correct some SF units are issued Multicam (saw a picture of a SF soldier in Afghan wearing Multicam in the most recent publication of SOLDIER magazine.)

[Javelin66]

It seems like this question comes up a lot here.

The Army does test, evaluate, and compare camouflage patterns. This is done out at the Natick Labs, specifically in the camouflage evaluation facility.

http://nsc.natick.army.mil/media/fact/facilities/CEF.htm

Once the Army decides we want it (or any piece of kit), and congress approves, it becomes a program of record. At that point it is handled by a program manager (or PM, an Army officer responsible for partnering with industry to get the item designed, manufactured, and out to the field).

The PM for uniforms is part of the Program Executive Office (PEO) Soldier:
https://peosoldier.army.mil/programs/pmseq.asp?#cie

All of the services have a similar set up- this is all mandated by law. In some cases, there is a Joint Program Manager, or a single service is appointed the executive agent for a common item- for instance, small arms ammunition is handled by the Army.

I should add that in addition to the lab testing the Army does conduct live field experiments. In fact, the Army's EXFOR at Ft Benning wears multicam now.

I served in Iraq with an NCO that was part of the last round of tests out at the NTC in 2003/4ish. Multicam was not part of the test, but he thought that the ACU won because it was mediocre in most environments, while the other patterns tested excelled in one but failed in many.

[army_grunt_11B]

Sorry I can't scan in the Army Times paper to prove my story, It was the June issue I believe? BUT the ARMY is going to issue Multi-Cam to Units going to A-Stan, It wont start tell 2010ish though, and its only units deploying to A-Stan,

[Javelin66]

This may be what you are talking about:

http://www.military.com/news/article/congress-orders-afghanistan-uniform-probe.html

Don't confuse a test and evalutation with a decision to field the uniform. Four sets of multicam times several thousand troops at $50-$100 a set adds up.

Do you mean to say that half of SF guys have 'beards'?

[army_grunt_11B]

Negative on that article, It was printed weeks before that, I was still in GA when it was printed, so it was May or June Issue, I read it a few times over since I was in AA at the time bored out of my mind to make sure, it sayed the Army was being forced to find a new Uniform (Not necessarly Multi Cam, but it pointed heavly into that way) for Operations in A-Stan, and they had picked a picked a digital Camo that worked well in Desert and Jungle enviorments, that they planned to start giving to Units deploying after 2010 to that region.

[mtnsldr]

Yes, there was an article about a congressional inquiry into creating an alternate uniform for operations in Iraq. I don't remember it saying that MultiCam was going to win the contract, and I don't remember it saying that it was even a directive yet...

PFC, you know what assumptions get you, right?

[army_grunt_11B]

Roger Sir, My mistake, my apologies

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

Sorry for ressurection of this thread but look what I came across!

http://www.army.mil/-news/2009/10/30/29559-army-always-seeking-improvements-to-combat-uniform/?ref=home-headline-link0

I came across this just now and it bascially talks about the improvements of the ACU's from thicker seats, to IR tabs, but towards the end of the article, a new pattern. The Army is currently testing UCP - Delta (a variant of the current pattern but with a cayote brown color to break the grey and greens) and.....Multicam. I just wanted to share this with you all. Whatever helps protect the lives of the ones who protect us.

[mtnsldr]

My old unit will be one of the "test" elements for UCP-D. This won't solve the issue of Congress asking for one uniform for all services. To me it would make more sense to solve that issue first, make it the BEST choice out there, then field it out to all the folks going into the field, but what do I know...

[Sandbagger]

My old unit will be one of the "test" elements for UCP-D. This won't solve the issue of Congress asking for one uniform for all services. To me it would make more sense to solve that issue first, make it the BEST choice out there, then field it out to all the folks going into the field, but what do I know...

This is where I'm coming from. When I worked uniform issue back in '04, the fact that we all wore DCU's helped me to support, USAF, Army or Navy personnel.

[ArmyJrotc Raider]

Having read a lot of airsoft forums, and articles on the replacement, or improvement of the ACU, my mind is in jumbles of having seeing a bunch of different camouflages around the world that have all been proved exceptional in the battlefield. But the question that still lingers is, How to make it all better? So the questions I am asking the active, senior, and experienced members of this forum are, what would you use. what are your designs, and what works? comparisons from my studies of the camouflages that are working well, for airsoft junkies, are Multicam, Mirage camo, MARPAT woodland and desert, and ACU (select conditions only). Please provide a description of your choice/design too, to prevent "one liners."

[Sandbagger]

I'm of the camp that believes that a good disruptive pattern on a uniform which effectively reflects ambient colors (in the sense that if you hold a red balloon up to a white wall that the white wall reflects the color red) is more important than matching every different color in every single environment.

The UCP does both of these rather effectively. The contention comes in the way that it does it without the use of pleasing earth tones. In theory, you could apply the disruptive pattern and reflective qualities of the UCP to browns, tans and greens and get a very effective pattern. This is what I would endorse. It would be like the MARPAT only a few shades lighter.

[/opinion]